in my opinion, thats what creationism was designed to do, leave you with no questions. not necessarily explain how or what, but to satisfy man’s need to know. if you believe in creationism, i assume you mean God created all this. ok, thats cool. but the scientific method must ask the next question; how did he do it? and creationism does not answer that question, it just says he did. and that has been a great comfort to human beings.
the scientific method is completely anti-faith. faith by definition means there is no evidence. mankind and understanding is inevitabley heading towards being based on scientific methods because of the internet and the availablity of information. even einstein used “god” to answer questions he didnt have the answer too.
i have my own strong beliefs but have stopped trying to change people’s minds- though i love a good discussion! at this point i really really want to dialogue with people of faith to understand what and how they see it. its a touchy subject and part of the fun is that we get passionate about it, but that usually leads to unproductive exchanges.
creationism and believing in God forbids you to know how God did it or how God works. that ceiling to knowledge and my understanding is completely unacceptable to me.
i have always subscribed to a multi-universe theory. i think there are and have been bazillions. but i dont believe they exist as one for every posibility. like parallel universes. so i never was sugary sweet on the “quantum” thing as a whole, but was definitely feeling the duality particle / wave stuff and how if “viewed” events are influened and changed in the quantum realm (very sub atomic particles).
but it wasnt until like a few months ago i made the connection between meditation and such (and energy it could bring) and its effect in the quantum realm. there now is at least a glimmer of what could be the connection of how thoughts, prayers, meditations and what some call spiritual energy interfaces and interacts in what we perceive to be the physical world.
science is getting close to describing things once thought of as metaphysical in scientific terms. just like when we thought chariots pulled the sun across the sky until science and observation showed us different.
august 24, 2010
Jeffery Jefferytv Mitchell i can try to answer for why i am spiritual but dont believe in god. god is a supreme being that is not only separate from our universe, but is above it and controls it. i do not believe such an entity exists.
i believe there are interactions between our consciousness’ that we are not aware of yet. i believe that feeling you get with a group; church, when cheering at a football game or getting it in a club is a form or spirituality. i believe there is human created spirituality. i dont believe spiritual means supernatural. spirituality to me is a network that connects everything in the universe that we have not detected yet. we communicate with each other in ways we are not aware of yet.
as far as “spirits” go, im leaning towards individual consciousness each having an energy that is unique and has information. not sure if i believe it can actively interact or just exist as a spirit or essence of someone.
i believe in faith. faith works and is for real. i believe you would get the same results if you put your faith in god or a suitcase. its your faith that moves.
i believe in religion as the organization, ritualization, ceremony, reverence, art, prayers, archectecture, fellowship, etc. religion is the organized structure that when not perverted is a good thing.
i believe in meditation and “prayer” as they work with faith and somehow when individual consciousness focus on something there is an effect on the whole because of the unknown connectivity we have with each other (a spirituality network)
xxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxx Jeffery, it pretty much sounds like you believe on God, you just express it differently.
Jeffery Jefferytv Mitchell @xxxx please explain, i dont see how after i stated what i believe god is and that i dont believe in that. maybe if you believe what im describing is god, maybe what you believe in is not god.
july 23, 2010
is there ANY possibility that YOU and the spirit of love and the people around you could have been the catalyst for such a change? could it just have been time for a change? where was the lord when you were having these problems? did the lord say “ok, today i will unburden the bossman” or was it you who decided deep down that it was time for a change and used your own “power of faith” in god (not god) to make things happen?
how do you know it was the lord? did he talk to you? did something happen to give you an indication that a supernatural event occurred?
i believe in faith and that faith works. we get power and energy from faith (no matter what its in) and not from any external entity in the sky. i believe we make our own miracles…
people gonna say im not a believer and that since i dont believe i dont understand. but i would really like for someone to explain to me these things and not be defensive, dismissive or beg me just to believe and except without reason….
love is highest
i saw it first in my great grandmother. how everything in the family passed threw her house in some way or form. i saw how much work and love and drama and kids and food and church and everything she did. i was in church with her every single sunday i stayed over her house and i saw her praise the lord with all her heart. i understand now she was celebrating and fueling her faith. singing and gaining energy, peace of mind, meditation. but when she got home and was handling us kids and business, it was clear to me god ain’t have nothing to do with that. it was on her strength, experience and knowledge that we rode, though she would thank god for it all day long.
i believe ive gotten most of what i am from my parents. knowledge and strength that was passed to them from many generations and cultures. thousands of years of magic and miracles and love has been passed down to us by that which has evolved before us.
@Harriet thanks for your response. I think in a way we are saying the same thing about faith. hope i aint get too excited about this! LOL…
Tee Cooksey : Jeffery Mitchell: Thank you for the above query. I was driving when your comment came across my blackberry, in route to bible study however, I was very moved by your questions and couldn’t wait to get settled so I could address them accordingly and respectively.
First, let me say YES, there is a possibility that Derrick, the Spirit of Love and the people around him were catalyst for such a change because God (with a capital G) is love and He is also a Spirit. 1John 4:8 states, “Whoever does not love, does not know God, because God is love.”
Second, in another passage of scripture (John 4:24), the writer states, “God is Spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth”
Third, the people around him were in fact catalysts and/or vessels whom God used to prompt the change which came about—particularly his woman, Sherry, whom I know, is SAVED, Sanctified and filled with Holy Ghost—however she never judged or gave up on him, but remained steadfast in prayer for his soul!
Fourth, with respect to your question, “could it just have been time for a change?” Yes, it was time for a change, however you must understand that the things which belong to us as human beings, we’ve been endowed to do in and of ourselves, meaning, there are certain things we have power over…and those things take little to no effort at all, but then there are things such as breathing, whereby we must rely on the One who is the GIVER and SUSTAINER of life to do, as well as to bring about the change you’re witnessing in Derrick by the very testimony that’s coming from his mouth.
Fifth, concerning your questions, “where was the lord when you were having these problems? did the lord say “ok, today i will unburden the bossman” or was it you who decided deep down that it was time for a change and used your own “power of faith” in god (not god) to make things happen?
Jeffrey, it’s quite evident that the LORD was present when he was having problems, seeing as though he is an over-comer and has lived to testify of the LORDS goodness and sustaining power.
Yes and No Jeffrey concerning whether Derrick decided on his own that it was time for a change. No because the bible teaches us that “No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him.” (John 6:44) This means that the drawing is totally beyond our control. On the other hand, Yes, because while he didn’t decide the day or hour in which he would receive his salvation, (since this was already planned before the foundations of the world), he did in fact answer the call and said YES, I’m ready for a change LORD. So you see it’s two-fold, God calls and those who accept the call, have a willing spirit to say YES to the call.
Sixth, “how did he know it was the LORD, did something happen to give him an indication that a supernatural event occurred.” Jeffrey you just know, and if I were to try to explain it, I’d be spinning my wheels since that which I’m speaking and that which Derrick experienced (and is experiencing) when he accepted the call, are spiritual and would be hard for you to understand or even comprehend in the natural since the scripture states:
“These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned” (1 Corinthians 2: 13-14).
Seventh, it’s good that you believe in faith and that it works however, it sounds as if you have faith in yourself and not in GOD and therefore you’re operating under a different set of principles and beliefs which will only work for so long because there will come a time when you will recognize that you cannot sustain yourself…and you WILL look to the hills from whence cometh your help because all of your help comes from the LORD, whether you realize it or not. And just like there was an appointed day/hour for Derrick, there will be an appointed day for you as well…in fact, I think the hour is now..which is probably why I felt so compelled to respond to you in detail.
Finally, I wouldn’t say that you’re not a believer but more so an agnostic, which is someone who believes that there is not enough evidence to prove or disprove whether or not, God exists. And that’s ok…you’re not deficient because you’re different. We’re all different. And God is not angry with you for having questions—He wants you to ask questions and those of us who take time to study the WORD and not just go to church and have a religious emotional experience on Sunday know that the scripture teaches us to “always be ready to give an answer to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you…” (1Peter 3:15).
So in summation, I feel that you asked the right questions…that’s what an intelligent individual does. I’m the same way, I don’t take anyone’s word…I read it, study it, research it, pray on it, and then teach I it.
That being said, I think you were hitting on all the right points however your points are misguided! I will pray for you Jeffrey…that the Father of Lights draws you to Him, (as he did with Derrick) and cause His light to shine in the dark places of your life. I will pray that He removes the scales from your eyes in order that you might see and accept the TRUTH and I will pray that you come into the knowledge of who you are in Christ Jesus! Additionally, if you truly desire to know not just the God in heaven but the God who resides everywhere, who created the heavens and the earth and everything that dwells within, I’d be delighted to minister His plan of Salvation to you. For this is my vocation…winning souls for Christ and definitely one in which I take pleasure in and strive daily to walk worthy of my calling.
God Bless you my brother. I hope the above information helps! Tee
Jeffery Pure-Funk Mitchell @tee WOW! thank you thank you thank you for your response. i read it the first day and have been glancing over and thinking about it the last few days. and im still digesting. there are points you make that i do not agree with or i think “incorrect” but i dont want to go point -counter point (yet) as i want to absorb and learn and try to see it as … See Moreyou do. so i really do thank you and i LOVE my blackberry!! LOL ok i may stereotype but a church and jesus lovin black female with a blackberry gettin facebook mobile updates on her way to bible study? see, i need to open my eyes!!
You know I preach that faith works. “Faith in what” is where yall get it wrong. Stripping yourself, people and the family around you, the earth and life of its “magical” capabilities and accomplishments.
Because of evolution, it is physically impossible for there to be a better place than earth for human beings.
i’m assuming the traditional definition of “heaven” as “a place your soul goes to be with god after you die.” If a “soul” or spirit exists, it is not human. There has to be a transformation to something that has never been observed and for which no evidence exists.
Correction: If a “soul” or spirit exists, it is not a human being. It could be “human” though.
No heaven or hell
We are not born in sin
I believe religion and faith “work” and are benefits.
Faith is the belief in things for which there is no evidence. It seems we associate blind unconditional devotion with faith also. The devotion that religious people have is like being “in love” with a philosophy or with life. They can transfer what they know as a natural love for another person to an object, institution or belief.
As long as we choose to live “under god,” we will always be under some kind of god. For mankind and maybe life itself to reach its full potential we must rise above the limits god and religion instills.
I do not believe in good or bad. Everything is relative.
Evil does not exist
There never was nothing
prayer = meditation.
praying is meditating.
jan 28, 2010
From a recent facebook post:
Jeffery Jefferytv Mitchell how does your faith explain a compassionate protecting god and recent tragic events? are you truly satisfied by the way your belief system answers this and ANY other questions that you are confronted with? if you are, that’s all that counts and no man or questioning should ever trouble you. and that’s where i am with m…y beliefs as an atheist, never troubled…
Andrea Gilliam-Washington The Bible speaks of wars and rumors of wars and also various calamity happening in the “last days” Human death is not so paramount to God.
Death is just a mere truncation to the number of days that we (thought we) have left. As if our God even owes us a ‘tomorrow’. To me, death is a mere shadow of reality. They’re facing their judgement,……. … See Morethe way the rest of us will.
The question doesn’t trouble me…..*maybe* and I use the maybe loosely your non belief troubles me. But again, we all have choices and “free will”. Did I answer?! 😉
Jeffery Jefferytv Mitchell the question was deliberately worded as to be a “question” that can only be answered by one to one’s self. but since we gettin technical, i will evaluate.
you refer to the bible as if its the ultimate authority, like its guaranteed. i can show you scripture that even you disagree with. you then use the bible to demean human life in god’s eyes and as a whole. and infer that we are blessed that god even lets us live at all. this does not seem logical as to why he would give us life in the first place at all…
the statement “To me, death is a mere shadow of reality” is poetic but means absolutely nothing, and its not even accurate. death is reality not a shadow of it. … See More
as far as them “facing judgement” thats a major assumption you are making based on faith. how you reconcile that with a compassionate god who would kill 100,000 and injure (not kill to send to judgement) is a whole other discussion.
i admit i fired this post directly at the doubts i know believers have. and i commend you for your honesty in using “*maybe*.” that “maybe” basically makes my case. cause ii have no doubts or maybes cause i dont believe in anything that i dont undestand.
the icing on this cake is you have NO PROOF OR EVIDENCE for anything you say, you take it on faith. now you may say that i dont either, but i didnt make any claims about reality.
nov 15, 2009
“If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.” (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)
“However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way.” (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)
oct 4, 2009
i have witnessed and felt the power of both faith and love. I am an atheist but I have faith in spiritual things. I am not a skeptic. “redirecting” the power and energy of faith to focus on ourselves and not in the sky will eliminate 95% of the worlds problems and create a heaven on earth.
I can’t think of anything that can replace the power faith has in human beings, besides love which is also a faith. “Redidrecting” faith will make humanity “better” cause we would treat each other and everything around us as we treat god. From this our morals will come. Like a “natural morality”
the goal of life is survival, to continue “forever.” not for one form of it to be delivered to a better place forsaking all that life in its many forms has evolved to be. the goal of the bible is to discard mother earth, all life and all sh…e and we have created for a unseen unproven “better” place. the goal of the bible is the end of life.
devoting your life to god and living under pre-determined philosophies is not living, its existing. accepting you can never go or be “higher” than that is not fully living your life or utilizing your consciousness. so when people say by bel…ieving in god they loose nothing if wrong when they die as opposed to non-believers, I say your not really living your life fully with that mindset.
sept 19, 2009
To get to the point when you are living life according to self developed “rules” and understandings. To have love for everything with confidence and no fears according to your own moral code. Not having to answer to anything in any universe for what one believes, be it in life or at death.
I have grown to be free to place my faith in whatever I want and shape it however I want answering to nothing and there is an euphoric freedom in this. I believe conscious freedom is the most grand attainable thing.To find harmony with everything based on one’s own beliefs and not following or bowing down to anything is the heaven many people seek
a life and an act like that is not in harmony with everything
around it. It causes a friction to some degree.
to be in harmony with everything around you living according to
your own inherent personal moral code without fear of any kind of
to live under no one’s or any god’s understanding of how you
should live but your own. You don’t have to go to a book or any
kind of spiritual leader for guidance or answers. It becomes all
but natural and is revealed in your every act, right down to the
way you move. Its a confidence that everyone can see. There is no
guilt or worry cause you are not trying to live up to an external
You place yourself and everything around you at the same level or
higher than what a lot of people call god. Everything becomes
“god” and a part of god and you treat everything with that kind
of reverence, and you are in harmony with it all. Achieving this
understanding during one’s life is heaven on earth for this
harmony protects you from “evil” and the things
around you will come to your rescue when you need them. Harmony
also means taking care of your physical body: eating healthy,
being active physically and mentally. Always continuing to learn
as life and your environment changes, etc…
The following are excerpts from my webpages over the years that addressed
God & Religion. These are basically my earliest religious internet writings.
THERE IS NO GOD and if your calling the “whatever” that created us God, he, she or it most certainly didn’t create us in his, her or it’s image. there is no devil, hell, heaven or son of God. There probably was a Jesus, and he was a very gifted man with many wise teachings and insight.
Eternal life is Man’s ultimate hope, Man has never wanted to believe that death is the end. Death is man’s #1 fear and all creatures fear death most. God is #2 and only man has “God”
RELIGION uses man’s ultimate fears and his ultimate hopesprobably with good intentions. The Bible evolved to declare certain tendencies of humankind as being wrong and immoral (sins). These actions were more than likely seen as detrimental to the success of the society.Man wrote the Bible then states that God said it; “the word of God,” thus giving the book the backing of an all powerful force.Certain institutions then gained control of the Bible, which defined God. they used God to enforce the words in the Bible (“the wages of sin are death, but the gift of God is eternal life”), which they interpreted.
This created organized religion, which set the rules that a man must live by. It gave control of man to the institutions that controlled the religion (“in the name of God”). Some of this control had sincere intention, some was for profit and some to dominate and subdue.
This actually helped to “socialize” mankind. It set rules governing our natural instincts and actions.
THE BIBLE After removing the “God gonna get you stuff,” for the most part the Bible and the teachings of Jesus make good sense. Not as a guide for one man to live forever, (which can’t happen cause forever won’t even last forever), but as a survival guide for Man the species to survive “forever.” The teachings of understanding, kindness, acceptance and even hygiene are healthy for mankind as a whole.
CONSCIOUSNESS The gaining of consciousness was the most important development in our evolution from animal to Man. (We can do what we want) The gaining “knowledge of self” was the original sin. Before consciousness, living creatures could not sin. Organisms and animals that are controlled by instinct must obey the laws of nature and do not have freewill or the ability to sin. Consciousness puts man above the laws of nature giving humans the ability to break these laws. Thats why one can say “we are born in sin.” We are born with the ability to sin (but lets not forget the whole idea of “sin” is man-made). The fact that we can kill ourselves is the grand example of our freedom and capability over nature, nothing else can deliberately end its own existence (suicide).
WHAT RELIGION DOES Most western religions strip the carbon based life of the sun-earth system of its accomplishments and attributes them to a non-existent God.
The first amino acid and dna, rna combinations, the first single cell organism, the first creature to move, to breath oxygen, etc. All these things along with the relatively recent accomplishments of Man are given to God, then religion even goes on to say Man is flawed and sinful.
Man evolved consciousness, man evolved love, understanding, communication, spirituality and social aspects of his species. Because we gained consciousness, we lost instinctive instruction. We were no longer controlled by instinct so we had to develop a system to survive and live within.
|Part of the brilliance of the doctrine….
Posted by ATHEISTICFUNK1 on 11/21/2003, 4:25 pm,
in reply to “Re: prayer is belief and faith based…”that created God is that there can be no “evidence to the contrary” (there is no such evidence possible to disprove God
or invalidate God’s existence) and this same doctrine (the Bible) does not present any verifiable or testable evidence for the existence of God. I do not rule out the possibility, i just don’t think there is and I ain’t seen no reason to think there isstill. Much respect for everyone and their beliefs, should they agree with mine or not as diversity is key to the success of life. It does not bother me that humans have so many different ideas of what life is and what life should be and diversity does not mean dilution. Much respect to everyone and their individual beliefs and philosophies(philosophyofchoice.com). The fellowship of religion (or anything) is spirituality.The feeling we get knowing and understanding that over thousands of years many people and many cultures have said this or that prayer or performed this or that ritual is a part of spirituality.
The Black Skeptics Group which was founded by Dr. Sikivu Hutchinson, will hold a monthly gatherinng at Simply Wholesome in Los Angeles on December 19, 2010 at 11:30 am. Open dialogue and discussion of future events is planned.
http://blackskeptics.blogspot.com/ for more information.
In association with www.blackhumanism.org
Asked about the Baylor findings, Philip Yancey, author of What Good Is God?, says he moved from the Authoritative God of his youth — “a scowling, super-policeman in the sky, waiting to smash someone having a good time” — to a “God like a doctor who has my best interest at heart, even if sometimes I don’t like his diagnosis or prescriptions.”
•The Critical God. The poor, the suffering and the exploited in this world often believe in a Critical God who keeps an eye on this world but delivers justice in the next, Bader says.
Bader says this view of God — held by 21% of Americans — was reflected in a sermon at a working-class neighborhood church the researchers visited in Rifle, Colo., in 2008. Pastor Del Whittington’s theme at Open Door Church was ” ‘Wait until heaven, and accounts will be settled.’ ”
Bader says Whittington described how ” ‘our cars that are breaking down here will be chariots in heaven. Our empty bank accounts will be storehouses with the Lord.’ ”
•The Distant God. Though about 5% of Americans are atheists or agnostics, Baylor found that nearly one in four (24%) see a Distant God that booted up the universe, then left humanity alone.
This doesn’t mean that such people have no religion. It’s the dominant view of Jews and other followers of world religions and philosophies such as Buddhism or Hinduism, the Baylor research finds.
Rabbi Jamie Korngold of Boulder, Colo., took Baylor’s God quiz and clicked with the Distant God view “that gives me more personal responsibility. There’s no one that can fix things if I mess them up. God’s not telling me what I should do,” says Korngold. Her upcoming book, God Envy: A Rabbi’s Confession, is subtitled, A Book for People Who Don’t Believe God Can Intervene in Their Lives and Why Judaism Is Still Important.
Others who cite a Distant God identify more with the spiritual and speak of the unknowable God behind the creation of rainbows, mountains or elegant mathematical theorems, the Baylor writers found.
This distant view is nothing new. Benjamin Franklin once wrote that he could not imagine that a “Supremely Perfect” God cares a whit for “such an inconsiderable Nothing as Man.”
The Baylor researchers’ four views of God reveal a richness that denominational labels often don’t capture. They found that Catholics and mainline Protestants are about evenly divided among all four views, leaning slightly toward a Benevolent God. More than half of white evangelicals identify with an Authoritative God; that view is shared by more than seven in 10 black evangelicals, they said.
Steve Harvey discusses his feelings about atheists with Joy Behar